Universal's Epic Universe General News & Discussion

[belloq87]

I thought the video was pretty fair, as he repeatedly said that it's not a reflection on Dark Universe's quality, and he mentioned how much of a people-eater Monsters Unchained is (compared to the other headliners).

Isn't it pretty objectively true that it's the least-busy of the four lands?

Now, if the larger point is that Dark Universe shouldn't be used to either bolster or undermine a case for a "darker" Villains Land, then sure.

 

[Brian G.]

I thought the video was pretty fair, as he repeatedly said that it's not a reflection on Dark Universe's quality, and he mentioned how much of a people-eater Monsters Unchained is (compared to the other headliners).

Isn't it pretty objectively true that it's the least-busy of the four lands?

Now, if the larger point is that Dark Universe shouldn't be used to either bolster or undermine a case for a "darker" Villains Land, then sure.

That does not make it a “failure”, however. I’m watching the video now though.

 

[AvoidTIMtation]

He spent a big chunk of time stating the blatantly obvious regarding Dark Universe: Monster's high capacity vs the other big rides, Nintendo and Potter are more popular, etc.

 

[Tbad556]

Is it supposed to be a massive surprise that a Universal Monsters land isn't as busy as *checks notes* Harry Potter, How To Train Your Dragon, and Nintendo? Seems like an issue in setting expectations appropriately if you went into it expecting Universal Monsters to compete with some of the biggest franchises in the world...

Regardless, like everyone else has already said, that's skipping right past a ton of other notes on capacity currently. Not interested in contributing to the view count for clickbait videos, though, so I'll have to take y'all at your word that the discussion is that shallow.

 

[Brian G.]

Is it supposed to be a massive surprise that a Universal Monsters land isn't as busy as *checks notes* Harry Potter, How To Train Your Dragon, and Nintendo? Seems like a skill issue in setting expectations appropriately if you went into it expecting Universal Monsters to compete with some of the biggest franchises in the world...

Regardless, like everyone else has already said, that's skipping right past a ton of other notes on capacity currently. Not interested in contributing to the view count for clickbait videos though, so I'll have to take y'all at your word that the argument is that shallow.

It’s a bizarre video, and honestly, it's part of a larger trend with “hot take” content. A hypothesis gets planted, and then the rest of the video kind of rambles around it.

To his credit, he actually acknowledges several points fairly along the way, but it’s the framing that’s odd. He starts by saying "Monsters is a failure," but presents fair examples that contradict the original point. It creates this strange result where the video sounds balanced on the surface, but the points he makes don’t really support the claim he opened with.

 

[SeventyOne]

It’s a bizarre video, and honestly, it's part of a larger trend with “hot take” content. A hypothesis gets planted, and then the rest of the video kind of rambles around it.

To his credit, he actually acknowledges several points fairly along the way, but it’s the framing that’s odd. He starts by saying "Monsters is a failure," but presents fair examples that contradict the original point. It creates this strange result where the video sounds balanced on the surface, but the points he makes don’t really support the claim he opened with.

It's also somewhat moot because his later thesis -- Villains Land was never going to be dark like Monsters Land, Disney doesn't do things that scary -- holds true even if the latter were the runaway hit of EU.

On the whole a fan of PE, willing to let a one-off video slide, but the script probably could've used a second pass.

 

[Brian G.]

It's also somewhat moot because his later thesis -- Villains Land was never going to be dark like Monsters Land, Disney doesn't do things that scary -- holds true even if the latter were the runaway hit of EU.

On the whole a fan of PE, willing to let a one-off video slide, but the script probably could've used a second pass.

I hear ya. I’m not trying to dogpile on him. I’ve watched several of his videos before and enjoyed them. This one just felt a little jumbled in how it gets from point A to B without really landing on a clear conclusion to support the original take.

A lot of the points seem to rely on rumors that have been debated but never really confirmed, so there isn’t much solid information to build a strong conclusion on anyway.

But content waits for no one! haha

 

[Casper Gutman]

I thought the video was pretty fair, as he repeatedly said that it's not a reflection on Dark Universe's quality, and he mentioned how much of a people-eater Monsters Unchained is (compared to the other headliners).

Isn't it pretty objectively true that it's the least-busy of the four lands?

Now, if the larger point is that Dark Universe shouldn't be used to either bolster or undermine a case for a "darker" Villains Land, then sure.

Dark Universe isn’t a failure. Much of it is beautiful and it has a great ride. It IS, sadly, the worst designed land in the park. The non-ride areas, particularly the shop, are far too small and limited and the land lacks pleasant or atmospheric spots to sit or wander - it’s a village without a village. The coaster was an absolutely terrible choice - it feels cheap, disrupts the atmosphere, and makes the land seem even smaller than it is. I fully understand not wanting to build another live show at Epic, but the replacement should have complemented the rest of the land.

These problems seem to reflect Universal’s lack of faith in the concept of - compared to the other lands it’s underbuilt, and the coaster reads as a panicked addition to boast appeal, one that disrupts the spooky atmosphere. All of that is a shame because so much of what’s in DU is so good. If Universal, the resort of HHN and the Monsters, got spooked by spooky, Disney was never going to go for that tone.

 

[quinnmac000]

I think DU represents the issues with a lot of modern them park design, which is you are creating high detailed lands but its being designed and engineered to please data analyst with every element focused on monetary gain vice what small things will bring out guest into the land and give them a sense of wonder and excitement. While MU is an amazing ride, that level of care and experience was only applied to half the land which isn't consistent and shows a lack of faith and belief in what they are selling. They also forget to sell the guest the chance of being the protagonist specifically in Dark Universe
.

 

[UniversalRBLX]

I know this is easy to say after the fact, but I would have held off on building Curse of the Werewolf and saved money by expanding the village just a bit more and added a well-themed flat ride... leaving space for a Phase 2 expansion. Heck, I would have been ok with them saving the Curse of the Werewolf idea for a Year 2 or 3 addition with proper theming and longer (even if that meant no Creature).

As a land, there just isn't much to do or explore. You have a quick service, a shop, makeup shop that's limited capacity and a M&G. Not much to retain people.

 

[Parkscope Joe]

I think DU represents the issues with a lot of modern them park design, which is you are creating high detailed lands but its being designed and engineered to please data analyst with every element focused on monetary gain vice what small things will bring out guest into the land and give them a sense of wonder and excitement. While MU is an amazing ride, that level of care and experience was only applied to half the land which isn't consistent and shows a lack of faith and belief in what they are selling. They also forget to sell the guest the chance of being the protagonist specifically in Dark Universe
.

This just isn’t true form what I’ve seen after my three visits to the parks.

 

[Brian G.]

Dark Universe isn’t a failure. Much of it is beautiful and it has a great ride. It IS, sadly, the worst designed land in the park. The non-ride areas, particularly the shop, are far too small and limited and the land lacks pleasant or atmospheric spots to sit or wander - it’s a village without a village. The coaster was an absolutely terrible choice - it feels cheap, disrupts the atmosphere, and makes the land seem even smaller than it is. I fully understand not wanting to build another live show at Epic, but the replacement should have complemented the rest of the land.

These problems seem to reflect Universal’s lack of faith in the concept of - compared to the other lands it’s underbuilt, and the coaster reads as a panicked addition to boast appeal, one that disrupts the spooky atmosphere. All of that is a shame because so much of what’s in DU is so good. If Universal, the resort of HHN and the Monsters, got spooked by spooky, Disney was never going to go for that tone.

I think DU represents the issues with a lot of modern them park design, which is you are creating high detailed lands but its being designed and engineered to please data analyst with every element focused on monetary gain vice what small things will bring out guest into the land and give them a sense of wonder and excitement. While MU is an amazing ride, that level of care and experience was only applied to half the land which isn't consistent and shows a lack of faith and belief in what they are selling.
.

The coaster replacing the show likely did shift the balance of the land, but calling it a panic move or saying Universal lacked faith doesn’t track when they dumped big money into Monsters Unchained, built out original lore, and invested in roaming characters.

This was always the riskiest land… and they still went all in on it.

The “designed for data analysts” argument doesn’t really hold up, either. If this were purely about spreadsheets and short-term ROI, you wouldn’t get a land this detailed, this niche, or this expensive.

They also forget to sell the guest the chance of being the protagonist specifically in Dark Universe

The “guest as the protagonist” point is more of a preference than something they “forgot.” The narrative is intentionally vague, and different characters will tell you different versions of the same story. It’s up to you to decide who’s telling the truth and who the “good guy” actually is.

lacks pleasant or atmospheric spots to sit or wander - it’s a village without a village.

EDIT: I wanted to circle back and to also talk about this point, too.

I don’t really buy the “village without a village” argument when the land is built around an active atmosphere. The bar has villagers telling stories, the town well is a character hub, and the land has constant kinetic moments like the windmill catching fire, the castle booming with electricity, and mist filling the graveyard.

There are places to sit and wander, they’re just not passive.

 

[Parkscope Joe]

The “designed for data analysts” argument doesn’t really hold up, either. If this were purely about spreadsheets and short-term ROI, you wouldn’t get a land this detailed, this niche, or this expensive.

I’d go as far and say if they really designed for data analysis then they wouldn’t have built the land!

 

[Mad Dog]

I love the land and Monsters ride. The coaster is not significant but it's better than I expected. Seems the land location though, makes it easy for a tourist to miss, or not notice. It's entrance, though beautifully themed, feels almost hidden from the Celestial land. All the other land entrances are highly visible and jump out at you.

 

[Parkscope Joe]

I love the land and Monsters ride. The coaster is not significant but it's better than I expected. Seems the land location though, makes it easy for a tourist to miss, or not notice. It's entrance, though beautifully themed, feels almost hidden from the Celestial land. All the other land entrances are highly visible and jump out at you.

I disagree, I think the portal hidden behind the burger place is harder to find from Celestial Park. Monsters sticks out the most!

 

[Dapale]

A family friend of mine (not a theme park enthusiast) visited Epic a few months ago, and completely missed dark universe (didn’t know it existed). They were very sad to have missed it.

I think we give the general public a bit too much credit in finding things.

 

[jwbitterman]

I find the layout of dark universe bizarre.

It's starts out super themed, then you have the major ride in the center of the land and then....not much. It's two completely different experiences and not for the better.

Outside of burning blade, there's not much going on in the latter 1/2 of the land (also, I think werewolf is a state fair level attraction , if I'm being generous). The second half of the land just looks under planned or not given much of the budget.

I ignore the second half of the land bc it takes me out of the immersion of the first half.

I just wonder what it would be like with the manor where burning blade is.

Just one persons opinion.

 

[Parkscope Joe]

A family friend of mine (not a theme park enthusiast) visited Epic a few months ago, and completely missed dark universe (didn’t know it existed). They were very sad to have missed it.

I think we give the general public a bit too much credit in finding things.

And the classic:

 

[PerceptiveCoot]

I disagree, I think the portal hidden behind the burger place is harder to find from Celestial Park. Monsters sticks out the most!

People will find that portal irrespective of whether it's hidden or not though.

 

[Josh55]

Ryan the Ride mechanic (who I wasn’t familiar with but, shockingly, is a ride mechanic has done a really interesting speculative video on what he thinks may be going on with Stardust. Far better than the click bait rubbish where people essentially say ‘it’s closed’ in different ways for 15 minutes:

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