Universal Orlando Resort Expansion (Part 1)

[Felipe]

Well, if they go through with this, that will be shattered. I think it would be cool to pair a new park with the water park and a new resort area. Wish I could be a fly on the walls for these discussions.

Right, but those plans seem to be for a decade down the road. And we never know, they might have some sort of system connecting it all.

For the time being, though, I think a big, elaborate themed water park (in this plot, which closest to current resort layout) would be the best "3rd gate" they could have. I think a major themed water park might even be more popular than a third theme park. Water rides are scarce at UOR, so it wouldn't take any business away from the theme parks because it would be in its own league within the resort.

Also, I think we can all agree that HP is the biggest reason people are coming to Universal, and I don't think a third gate would have HP, as everything that could be done has been done in these two parks, as far as "lands." So, I don't think a third gate would be as popular if it doesn't have a huge IP like it; a third theme-park gate would suffer because, even though it would be a novelty, many people would chose to go to USF and/or IoA over it because of Potter. I'm not saying Potter is the only important or worthwhile thing at UOR, but it's evident that the big pull for UOR has been, and continues to be, the boy who lived.

 

[JungleSkip]

For the time being, though, I think a big, elaborate themed water park (in this plot, which closest to current resort layout) would be the best "3rd gate" they could have. I think a major themed water park might even be more popular than a third theme park. Water rides are scarce at UOR, so it wouldn't take any business away from the theme parks because it would be in its own league within the resort.

Water rides are scarce at UOR? They have just as many water rides as Disney does across 4 parks.

Also, I think we can all agree that HP is the biggest reason people are coming to Universal, and I don't think a third gate would have HP, as everything that could be done has been done in these two parks, as far as "lands." So, I don't think a third gate would be as popular if it doesn't have a huge IP like it; a third theme-park gate would suffer because, even though it would be a novelty, many people would chose to go to USF and/or IoA over it because of Potter. I'm not saying Potter is the only important or worthwhile thing at UOR, but it's evident that the big pull for UOR has been, and continues to be, the boy who lived.

Sure. But they want to bring those people in and have them stay for longer. They want to be a resort, not a side piece. A third park will do that before a water park.

 

[Felipe]

Water rides are scarce at UOR? They have just as many water rides as Disney does across 4 parks.

I should clarify, I meant water rides designed to soak you, so I don't count JP, etc.; I mean the Ripsaw Falls, Popeye and Bluto's, etc. of Universal.

Sure. But they want to bring those people in and have them stay for longer. They want to be a resort, not a side piece. A third park will do that before a water park.

If they make this themed water park like Disney's or grander and more elaborate, then it would be a day-long attraction that should make guests stay longer.

 

[Hatetofly]

You could if you wanted to risk jail time and had deep pockets

They also make dragonflies and they can carry cameras :look:

 

[UniversalCityFL]

Sure. But they want to bring those people in and have them stay for longer. They want to be a resort, not a side piece. A third park will do that before a water park.

I wonder how much revenue actually comes in from a water park since food and merchandise is where the majority of theme park revenue comes from. At a water park, you perhaps rent a towel or tube and eat a light lunch, buy beverages, and that's it. There's no "exiting through the gift shop". I can't imagine a waterpark bringing in that much revenue (compared to a theme park) beyond the indirect benefit of staying on property a day longer.

Unless Universal reinvents what a water park is

 

[Ultimate17]

I'm sure its much cheaper to build a waterslide though, compared to an E-ticket in a theme park.

 

[Frank Drackman]

Very glad to hear that! I moved from Jacksonville in January 08. Used to do some work in the Bellsouth Tower. Not sure what's it called now though

I've been in that building a few times (probably in the '02 to '05 time frame and just for a week at a time or so) but even back then it seemed to be more CSX than Bellsouth. I have no idea what it is called now, but I doubt AT&T would have much of a presence there. I know the group I use to visit is no longer there.

 

[IzzyB]

I wonder how much revenue actually comes in from a water park since food and merchandise is where the majority of theme park revenue comes from. At a water park, you perhaps rent a towel or tube and eat a light lunch, buy beverages, and that's it. There's no "exiting through the gift shop". I can't imagine a waterpark bringing in that much revenue (compared to a theme park) beyond the indirect benefit of staying on property a day longer.

Unless Universal reinvents what a water park is

My friend goes to aquatica all the time and eats more than a light lunch. She also rents lockers and there is cabanas you can rent. They find ways to make money in a water park.

 

[Hatetofly]

I've been in that building a few times (probably in the '02 to '05 time frame and just for a week at a time or so) but even back then it seemed to be more CSX than Bellsouth. I have no idea what it is called now, but I doubt AT&T would have much of a presence there. I know the group I use to visit is no longer there.

The work we did was for CSX Transportation :thumbs:

 

[maxairmike]

I'm sure its much cheaper to build a waterslide though, compared to an E-ticket in a theme park.

A typical E-ticket is typically 10x more expensive than even some of the most elaborate/heavily themed slides out there. Basic, but major slides will typically run you no more than about $6 million from what I've heard, while more elaborate ones could push the $10 million mark. Compared to $50+ million for most major rides, it really is "cheap."

 

[Accio Butterbeer]

What would be the most realistic ideas or concepts for a third park?

 

[quickfire609]

What would be the most realistic ideas or concepts for a third park?

A Matrix Online based park with Gears of War and Halo

Throw something out there! Nobody really knows what will be in a third gate right now. Those who do, that stuff will change.

Look at IOA, Toon Lagoon was going to be Springfield (Simpsons), Marvel was going to be Gotham or DC Island, JP didn't exist for a while, etc. Things will change.

I just want to see a return of BTTF, I don't think it'll happen but boy do I want it.

 

[Starwarsfan13]

My sources are telling me that Bill Paxton is the mascot for the third gate...

 

[natespf]

What if the water park was Hard Rock?

For the 3rd gate there is a lot that can go into it. I know Star Trek NEEDS a good presence in UOR.

Something Halo could be cool, but IDK about that for a theme park.

 

[Hockeyman55]

I wonder how much revenue actually comes in from a water park since food and merchandise is where the majority of theme park revenue comes from. At a water park, you perhaps rent a towel or tube and eat a light lunch, buy beverages, and that's it. There's no "exiting through the gift shop". I can't imagine a waterpark bringing in that much revenue (compared to a theme park) beyond the indirect benefit of staying on property a day longer.

Unless Universal reinvents what a water park is

I take it you have never had to buy a $13 dollar bottle of sun block at a water park before ound:

But seriously, as Skip said, its also about getting people on site and getting them to stay longer. I wouldn't think water parks brought in as much revenue as a theme park, although im sure they do fairly well on food.

 

[mahnamahna]

Well, I can think of two basic themes/ideas for a 3rd gate (WonderSea Island is separate)

1. Universal Classics (Maybe a showcase of film history - not too different from World Showcase or the period areas of DCA) - Not a great idea

2. Discovery/Voyage (DisneySea for Universal)

It could have:
1. Transylvania (Van Helsing E-ticket using Pandora's Box, Frankenstein walkthrough, Black Lagoon submarine ride) with Horror Make-Up Show, Beetlejuice and Monsters Cafe moving here
2. Skull Island (Kong 360, Skull Island flume, etc)
3. Amity (new Jaws ride, stunt show, mini-carnival, etc)
4. a new version of Lost Continent (the old one can be split - 65% goes to Seuss, 35% goes to Potter) themed to just Greek mythology with a Poseidon E-ticket, a new Sinbad ride, etc
5. Middle-Earth (the main area of the new park) with a trackless E-ticket boat ride, complete immersion, and a top-notch show-stopping TOT-style ride themed to Sauron's tower
6. Hyrule (themed to Legend of Zelda) - Family-friendly dark ride, Splash Battle ride, state-of-the-art coaster in Zelda's Castle, amazing show
7. Mushroom Kingdom (adds family-friendly appeal) - Mario Kart ride similar to Autopia, E-ticket dark ride, a new coaster system ("bouncing" system of some sort) for a Yoshi coaster
8. Prehistoric area (Flintstones, Croods, etc) or DreamWorks area (HTTYD, Shrek, The Croods, Madagascar, and Kung Fu Panda) - either one

It might be too similar to IOA, but it would be an area where you can "discover" new realms (each one could be a different time period)


I think the second one has more potential than the first one (it would just become a dumping ground for old rides lol)

Either way, I love that USO is expanding like it's no one's business... can't wait until 2020 when USF and IOA leave DHS, and AK in the dust while a small Star Wars miniland, a retheme of Imagination! to Phineas and Ferb, and a Avatar edition of Soarin' is all Disney uses to combat the onslaught haha

Hoping Disney will wake up and see that Universal and even Busch are becoming legitimate competitors

 

[natespf]

I take it you have never had to buy a $13 dollar bottle of sun block at a water park before ound:

But seriously, as Skip said, its also about getting people on site and getting them to stay longer. I wouldn't think water parks brought in as much revenue as a theme park, although im sure they do fairly well on food.

Yes, and there still needs to be a profit in the admission price too for both types of parks. I think the original reference was more towards the % markup being more on food and merchandise. Let's say a family spends $400 to get into the park for one day, are they going to spend more than $400 in food and merch?

Some things to consider about a water park too, they take up less space, are a smaller investment, cost less to operate and maintain. As well as the ratio of employees to the size of the park and number of guests, more would be needed in a traditional park.

 

[Accio Butterbeer]

A Matrix Online based park with Gears of War and Halo

Throw something out there! Nobody really knows what will be in a third gate right now. Those who do, that stuff will change.

Look at IOA, Toon Lagoon was going to be Springfield (Simpsons), Marvel was going to be Gotham or DC Island, JP didn't exist for a while, etc. Things will change.

I just want to see a return of BTTF, I don't think it'll happen but boy do I want it.

Since BTTF is my all time favorite movie/trilogy/attraction I more than agree with you on that one! And since Simpsons ended up happening I could see DC island definitely happening which would also be the best thing ever! I mean Batman and Superman attractions at Universal! I'm getting goose bumps just thinking about these ideas!

 

[Accio Butterbeer]

Well, I can think of two basic themes/ideas for a 3rd gate (WonderSea Island is separate)

1. Universal Classics (Maybe a showcase of film history - not too different from World Showcase or the period areas of DCA) - Not a great idea

2. Discovery/Voyage (DisneySea for Universal)

It could have:
1. Transylvania (Van Helsing E-ticket using Pandora's Box, Frankenstein walkthrough, Black Lagoon submarine ride) with Horror Make-Up Show, Beetlejuice and Monsters Cafe moving here
2. Skull Island (Kong 360, Skull Island flume, etc)
3. Amity (new Jaws ride, stunt show, mini-carnival, etc)
4. a new version of Lost Continent (the old one can be split - 65% goes to Seuss, 35% goes to Potter) themed to just Greek mythology with a Poseidon E-ticket, a new Sinbad ride, etc
5. Middle-Earth (the main area of the new park) with a trackless E-ticket boat ride, complete immersion, and a top-notch show-stopping TOT-style ride themed to Sauron's tower
6. Hyrule (themed to Legend of Zelda) - Family-friendly dark ride, Splash Battle ride, state-of-the-art coaster in Zelda's Castle, amazing show
7. Mushroom Kingdom (adds family-friendly appeal) - Mario Kart ride similar to Autopia, E-ticket dark ride, a new coaster system ("bouncing" system of some sort) for a Yoshi coaster
8. Prehistoric area (Flintstones, Croods, etc) or DreamWorks area (HTTYD, Shrek, The Croods, Madagascar, and Kung Fu Panda) - either one

It might be too similar to IOA, but it would be an area where you can "discover" new realms (each one could be a different time period)


I think the second one has more potential than the first one (it would just become a dumping ground for old rides lol)

Either way, I love that USO is expanding like it's no one's business... can't wait until 2020 when USF and IOA leave DHS, and AK in the dust while a small Star Wars miniland, a retheme of Imagination! to Phineas and Ferb, and a Avatar edition of Soarin' is all Disney uses to combat the onslaught haha

Hoping Disney will wake up and see that Universal and even Busch are becoming legitimate competitors

Third Park: 1. LOTR land
2. DC island with Gotham City and Metropolis(E-Ticket attractions for Batman/Superman)
3. Horror Land(Classic Monsters Dark ride, Walking Dead attraction, Bates Motel/Psycho)
4. Action Packed(rides/shows for action movies)(007 attraction, Bourne stunt show, Fast and the Furious THE RIDE)
5. Classic tribute(King Kong, BTTF, JAWS) This one seems most unlikeliest to happen.
Side Note: Connected with MIB behind The Simpsons could be Sci-Fi land with : Star Trek, Battlestar Galactica, and maybe Oblivion? if it turns out to be a hit. And I love the Mushroom Kingdom idea btw :thumbs: would really like to see Super Mario in a theme park somehow.

 

[braddillman]

I'm new here (from Ottawa), actually hoping to land a job building simulators starting in June.
To me this thread is better than RCT! LOL

My inexperienced $0.02:

I'd see the 'engineering process' (sorry, LOL) as:

1) find themes with broad enough appeal and proven merchantability worth risking big $$$ on,
2) develop a matrix of theme vs ride, a chart which shows rides, attractions and shows for each theme, to make sure you don't have only dark rides and no roller coasters, etc.,
3a) compete the ideas within each theme, e.g. where should a flume ride go, if any? would it be better in Marioland or Musicville?
3b) look for crossovers and synergies between the themes
4) fine-tune and optimize for merchantability and opportunities

Theme ideas:
1. Marioland. No brainer. Kids and families. No shortage of ideas. Start with live MarioKart, with interactive 4D effects and an WiiU controller (or iPad) in each go-kart/RV to throw turtle shells, etc. Imagine the experience of a father and son together on that one. Add a static children's playground with plenty of spots to bounce. A dark ride through the kingdom. Characters, heroes, villains and princesses. This thing writes itself.
2. Superheroes, likely DC. But there's no denying what Marvel Cinematic has achieved. No shortage of ideas there.
3. Fantasy. Maybe World of Warcraft, lots of appeal there. Maybe middle Earth.
4. Sci-fi. Likely Star Trek, only one with enough broad appeal. If Star Trek, try to capture/re-create a similar level of immersion to Harry Potter. Theme from the new Star Trek reboot, but draw ideas from the whole franchise.
5. Music. Get a decent selection of house talent for daily shows. Reality show based talent show from the crowd/karaoke. Music themed rides like other parks.

Other theme ideas I'm less convinced (not enough broad appeal):
a) Steampunk and Sherlock Holmes.
b) Food and cooking.
c) REAL cars land, e.g. NASCAR, F1, Fast & Furious, Top Gear

I'll probably think of more later. Love this thread, thx everyone.