CineSational: A Symphonic Spectacular

[DOOMBOT]

I can understand the timing argument. That makes sense, and I certainly wouldn't want to be the Ops TM corralling the Mardi Gras parade crowds as they pack into the Lagoon viewing area each night.

(... But, Disney can apparently handle it with Fantasmic and has been doing that for close to 40 years, and even USF has got the equally uncomfortable Nightmare Fuel squeeze down to a science and they do that show like 18x a week or something, so .)

I also entirely agree with @Mad Dog that a park like USF is only better with CineSational operational. There is an entire park day to engage with Mardi Gras activities (which themselves really aren't that demanding imo) before capping off the night with the parade and CineSational, which still have a solid 30 to 60 minutes of buffer time between each other.

CineSational (along with Dreamworks) were the big expansion projects of 2024 for UOR, and that show is one of the very best things on offer in a park that is currently one of the worst in the area. It's just unfortunate to see it underutilized.

 

[Brian G.]

Alright, now that I'm home and free from distractions, I can type better

First, let me make clear that I agree that USF is better with CineSational running and love to see it used more overall. I'm not trying to say you're wrong for wanting it, but just explaining the UO perception to the best of my knowledge.

I can understand the timing argument. That makes sense, and I certainly wouldn't want to be the Ops TM corralling the Mardi Gras parade crowds as they pack into the Lagoon viewing area each night.

(... But, Disney can apparently handle it with Fantasmic and has been doing that for close to 40 years, and even USF has got the equally uncomfortable Nightmare Fuel squeeze down to a science and they do that show like 18x a week or something, so .)

I also entirely agree with @Mad Dog that a park like USF is only better with CineSational operational. There is an entire park day to engage with Mardi Gras activities (which themselves really aren't that demanding imo) before capping off the night with the parade and CineSational, which still have a solid 30 to 60 minutes of buffer time between each other.

Fantasmic works because Hollywood Studios is structured around that nighttime flow; it’s the anchor that pulls people to Hollywood Blvd at the end of the night. CineSational isn’t playing that same role during Mardi Gras, at least in Universal’s eyes (and FWIW, Disneyland currently treats Fantasmic as a seasonal nighttime offering). Nightmare Fuel works differently because it’s repeatable and contained; guests can choose which showtime they want throughout the night. Mardi Gras and CineSational would be two large, fixed events back-to-back.

With a 7pm parade, an 8:30 or 9pm CineSational, and a 9pm park close, the last 2-3 hours become securing a parade spot, immediately relocating to secure another spot, and losing time that would otherwise be spent riding attractions or visiting food booths.

It seems like Universal is trying to avoid pushing guests into a “pick one” scenario and would prefer them to roam, eat, and stay engaged with the event. Especially during a slower season, keeping guests fluid is likely the best option, and they probably have internal data that reflects that.

There is an entire park day to engage with Mardi Gras activities (which themselves really aren't that demanding imo)

I wanted to note this: While the food booths are open all day, most of the live music and performers don’t start until around 4 pm, so the evening hours matter much more.

 

[UniversalRBLX]

Starlight/MSEP will typically run an hour before HEA/Wishes each night... and they do a heck of a job managing that many people.

Right after the Mardi Gras parade, you'll see a stream of guests exiting... why not push to keep those folks inside the park for another hour or two?

 

[Brian G.]

Starlight/MSEP will typically run an hour before HEA/Wishes each night... and they do a heck of a job managing that many people.

Right after the Mardi Gras parade, you'll see a stream of guests exiting... why not push to keep those folks inside the park for another hour or two?

“Disney can do it, why can’t Universal?” really can't apply here, as it's not an apples-to-apples comparison.

MK crowd flow around nighttime parades was chaotic for years, to the point that Disney had to expand walkways and build new backstage exit paths just to relieve congestion. Not to mention, Disney didn't have a nighttime parade for about a decade and relied solely on the fireworks show until last year.

Disney can manage it now, but it took years of infrastructure and ops changes.

Universal doesn’t have that same luxury at USF at the moment.

 

[UniversalRBLX]

“Disney can do it, why can’t Universal?” really can't apply here, as it's not an apples-to-apples comparison.

MK crowd flow around nighttime parades was chaotic for years, to the point that Disney had to expand walkways and build new backstage exit paths just to relieve congestion. Not to mention, Disney didn't have a nighttime parade for about a decade and relied solely on the fireworks show until last year.

Disney can manage it now, but it took years of infrastructure and ops changes.

Universal doesn’t have that same luxury at USF at the moment.

I can be wrong, but Universal invested into creating a large venue to provide more viewing for nighttime shows. It has 2 large access points and they can easily resolve parade ops with better TM coordination to improve guest flow.

I'm not saying they can start tomorrow night, but it's also not an unreasonable option and there are solutions out there.

 

[Brian G.]

I can be wrong, but Universal invested into creating a large venue to provide more viewing for nighttime shows. It has 2 large access points and they can easily resolve parade ops with better TM coordination to improve guest flow.

I'm not saying they can start tomorrow night, but it's also not an unreasonable option and there are solutions out there.

I think you're just forcing it at this point.

 

[Disneyhead]

Why don't they have a Mardi Gras park closing lagoon show? Iko, Iko all day, ooohh.

It could be cool.

 

[UniversalRBLX]

I think you're just forcing it at this point.

Not really. I think I bring valid points up with decent reasoning.

Again, I'm not trying to argue for the sake of argument... I visit the parks with admiration and (unfortunately) with an eye on how to improve (both from a creative standpoint and a business/operational perspective). USF has a lot of glaring issues, but fixing the nighttime entertainment schedule to be more consistent is a quick solution IMO.

I see USF empty out after parades and 2 hours prior to park opening. At the same time, I visit the WDW parks after work (love being local), and they are livelier than during the day with folks waiting for dinner reservations and nighttime shows. I just don't see that level of interest at UOR.

 

[Speed]

For what it’s worth i’m hearing more and more that Mega Movie will move to a 6-7pm spot after MG is finished with Cinesational running

 

[Brian G.]

Not really. I think I bring valid points up with decent reasoning.

Again, I'm not trying to argue for the sake of argument... I visit the parks with admiration and (unfortunately) with an eye on how to improve (both from a creative standpoint and a business/operational perspective). USF has a lot of glaring issues, but fixing the nighttime entertainment schedule to be more consistent is a quick solution IMO.

I see USF empty out after parades and 2 hours prior to park opening. At the same time, I visit the WDW parks after work (love being local), and they are livelier than during the day with folks waiting for dinner reservations and nighttime shows. I just don't see that level of interest at UOR.

I just feel like we keep jumping to new arguments and comparisons without addressing each of your counterpoints.

Your 2019/2021 comparisons didn't really reflect normal/current Mardi Gras operations. The Disney examples assumed Universal had the same park culture and infrastructure that took Disney decades to build. So we end up moving to a new example instead, while also ignoring key points.

So, to summarize:

• USF often closes at 9.
• The parade already functions as the nighttime anchor.
• Mardi Gras revenue is heavily tied to keeping guests ordering at the bars and booths.
• USF doesn’t have the same late-night culture that WDW has built over decades.

The lagoon was designed to support nighttime entertainment in general, not necessarily to run back-to-back events. Even if we assume better TM coordination, you’re still asking guests to secure a parade spot and then relocate en masse to secure another viewing spot within a 60 min window.

Even if we solve the crowd rush to the lagoon, it still ignores Universal's desire for guests to be engaged with Mardi Gras, and for an event that is as much a food festival as a nighttime offering, that behavior matters.

It's a strategic choice that's also hindered by some Ops limitations. If the park were consistently open until 10 or 11, I’d feel differently.

As a separate point, I think we also need to remember that Disney isn't Universal, and vice versa. They're each going to have behaviors that we love and hate, and even though they are in each other's orbit, we can't always compare the two. Magic Kingdom is the ONLY park that has a regularly scheduled nighttime parade AND a fireworks show. It's not the norm, it's the exception.

 

[UniversalRBLX]

I just feel like we keep jumping to new arguments and comparisons without addressing each of your core counterpoints.

Your 2019/2021 comparisons didn't really reflect normal/current Mardi Gras operations. The Disney examples assumed Universal had the same park culture and infrastructure that took Disney decades to build. So we end up moving to a new example instead, while also ignoring key points.

So, to summarize:

• USF often closes at 9.
• The parade already functions as the nighttime anchor.
• Mardi Gras revenue is heavily tied to keeping guests ordering at the bars and booths.
• USF doesn’t have the same late-night culture that WDW has built over decades.

The lagoon was designed to support nighttime entertainment in general, not necessarily to run back-to-back events. Even if we assume better TM coordination, you’re still asking guests to secure a parade spot and then relocate en masse to secure another viewing spot within a 60 min window.

Even if we solve the crowd rush to the lagoon, it still ignores Universal's desire for guests to be engaged with Mardi Gras, and for an event that is as much a food festival as a nighttime offering, that behavior matters.

It's a strategic choice that's also hindered by some Ops limitations. If the park were consistently open until 10 or 11, I’d feel differently.

As a separate point, I think we also need to remember that Disney isn't Universal, and vice versa. They're each going to have behaviors that we love and hate, and even though they are in each other's orbit, we can't always compare the two. Magic Kingdom is the ONLY park that has a regularly scheduled nighttime parade AND a fireworks show. It's not the norm, it's the exception.

If Universal can operate the holiday parade and CineSational during Holidays, why not during Mardi Gras as well? They run CineSational during the "low attendance period" of January. Why not try and see what happens when you do it for one year during Mardi Gras? If it fails and does nothing revenue-wise or increased interest in the park, I'll eat my words.

People flock out of USF (excl. concert nights) post-parade... why not incentivize them to stay with a nighttime show? Would more guests in the park for longer not encourage additional food & beverage sales?

USF doesn't have the same late-night culture that WDW has built because they refuse to keep the park open late. Look at USF's historical operating hours versus a park like Epcot that consistently operates 9-9. Last year they were closing USF at 7PM during Mardi Gras. It seems like this year they realized that was an issue and are rectifying with 9PM closures (albeit opening later in the morning - which is smart).




The reason why the Disney comparison is brought up is because Universal has voiced it's desire to be an alternative choice. They want to see themselves compete as a week-long vacation (not just against Disney but also the booming cruising industry).

The lagoon was designed to support nighttime entertainment in general, not necessarily to run back-to-back events. Even if we assume better TM coordination, you’re still asking guests to secure a parade spot and then relocate en masse to secure another viewing spot within a 60 min window.

This is not a major issue outside opening night for the parade. It's easy to walk up to the parade, same for CineSational (mainly due to people not knowing about it).


I want to be clear, I'm here to have a healthy discussion. I can care less about proving a point and being right. In my opinion, it seems like Universal has a great opportunity in front of them to be known for nighttime shows... and they just drop the ball at the 10-yard line.

 

[Brian G.]

I want to be clear, I'm here to have a healthy discussion. I can care less about proving a point and being right. In my opinion, it seems like Universal has a great opportunity in front of them to be known for nighttime shows... and they just drop the ball at the 10-yard line.

Then ya gotta stop picking and choosing what to argue. A lot of the questions you just asked have already been answered.

If Universal can operate the holiday parade and CineSational during Holidays, why not during Mardi Gras as well? They run CineSational during the "low attendance period" of January. Why not try and see what happens when you do it for one year? If it fails and does nothing revenue-wise or increased interest in the park, I'll eat my words.

Holidays are all-day with a 5:30 parade and late closings. Mardi Gras is afternoon-heavy, a 7pm parade with 8–9pm closes. You’d go straight from parade to lagoon, basically. Also, daylight savings time plays a bit of a factor.

But also, Universal doesn’t want guests stuck waiting 3-4 hours instead of spending at booths.

People flock out of USF (excl. concert nights) post-parade... why not incentivize them to stay with a nighttime show? Would more guests in the park for longer not encourage additional food & beverage sales?

With a 7pm parade, an 8:30 or 9pm CineSational, and a 9pm park close, the last 2-3 hours become securing a parade spot, immediately relocating to secure another spot, and losing time that would otherwise be spent riding attractions or visiting food booths.

It seems like Universal is trying to avoid pushing guests into a “pick one” scenario and would prefer them to roam, eat, and stay engaged with the event. Especially during a slower season, keeping guests fluid is likely the best option, and they probably have internal data that reflects that.

USF doesn't have the same late-night culture that WDW has built because they refuse to keep the park open late. Look at USF's historical operating hours versus a park like Epcot that consistently operates 9-9. Last year they were closing USF at 7PM during Mardi Gras. It seems like this year they realized that was an issue and are rectifying with 9PM closures (albeit opening later in the morning - which is smart).

Disney didn't have a nighttime parade for about a decade and relied solely on the fireworks show until last year.

Disney can manage it now, but it took years of infrastructure and ops changes.

Universal doesn’t have that same luxury at USF at the moment.

But ultimately, again, the big reason is that they feel the parade is the nighttime anchor. No other park besides the Magic Kingdom, the world's #1-visited theme park, has two nighttime shows running regularly.

The reason why the Disney comparison is brought up is because Universal has voiced it's desire to be an alternative choice. They want to see themselves compete as a week-long vacation (not just against Disney but also the booming cruising industry).

An alternative choice usually means they're presenting an alternative offering. Wanting to be a full vacation resort doesn’t automatically make it a Disney clone. Las Vegas, cruise lines, etc., aim for week-long stays too, but they’re judged on their own merits, not on how well they copy Disney.

This is not a major issue outside opening night for the parade. It's easy to walk up to the parade, same for CineSational (mainly due to people not knowing about it).

I was there on Tuesday night, and there was plenty of traffic just trying to get from Schwabb's to Cafe La Bamba after the parade. It's not just an opening night thing.